Seeing as some are on vacation,and the ones left
are overworked.On my Vacation had Computer on all

Week.Am not getting ERROR messages and am 70%
done and close to phase 3 cannot waste 346 Hours
of Computer time.I say \"PLEASE\" let us know
what is going on!!!!!

Have had computer 6 Months now.You would think
at least Boinc should Communicate with us??
Please get with the Program!!!
Sincerely:Doug Worrall

You would think
> at least Boinc should Communicate with us??
> Please get with the Program!!!
> Sincerely:Doug Worrall
>
>

Doug:
This must be a frustrating situation for eveyone on CPDN. Historically, these problems have resolved themselves, although this appears to be more serious than past downtimes.
It may be prudent to reduce activity on BOINC CPDN for a while, if only to reduce the number of calls on the servers, which have been maxed out according to Carl and others.
I am no expert in these matters, and in times like this I review Paul's letters to the uninitiated:

http://boinc-doc.net/site-common/glossary/letter-f.php5

as well as previous posts on the subject by Thyme Lawn, Crandles, Les Bayliss etc.
This reduces the anxiety a bit.

Good luck.
John Hopkinson

> You would think
> > at least Boinc should Communicate with us??
> > Please get with the Program!!!
> > Sincerely:Doug Worrall
> >
> >
>
> Doug:
> This must be a frustrating situation for eveyone on CPDN. Historically, these
> problems have resolved themselves, although this appears to be more serious
> than past downtimes.
> It may be prudent to reduce activity on BOINC CPDN for a while, if only to
> reduce the number of calls on the servers, which have been maxed out according
> to Carl and others.
> I am no expert in these matters, and in times like this I review Paul's
> letters to the uninitiated:
>
> http://boinc-doc.net/site-common/glossary/letter-f.php5
>
> as well as previous posts on the subject by Thyme Lawn, Crandles, Les Bayliss
> etc.
> This reduces the anxiety a bit.
>
> Good luck.
> John Hopkinson
> Thank you John.Just made it to Phase 3 of Project.Would I be helping to reduce
the Time share with Climate.Do not understand the complexities of servers,
and stuff like that.Thinking about joining a team,but heard Teams are not
getting credit either.Noticed that these Boards are a releif and feel more
like a person than a number.This Experiment is very important to our future,
want to keep crunching,but if it is better for Climate should I reduce 50%
share with Einstein? Thank you John,Doug Worrall
>

We can expect some sort of announcement/acknowledgement of the problem today. I don't want to say too much more and pre-empt that announcement too much.

> We can expect some sort of announcement/acknowledgement of the problem today.
> I don't want to say too much more and pre-empt that announcement too much.
>Thank you Crandles,You have been great help to me ever since I found these
Boards.I will never drop Climate!Enjoy all aspects of the experiment and data.
Sincerely,Doug Worrall>

> Week.Am not getting ERROR messages and am 70%
> done and close to phase 3 cannot waste 346 Hours
> of Computer time.I say "PLEASE" let us know
> what is going on!!!!!

Why do you think you are in danger of "wasting" 346 hours. The only way that will happen is if you abandon the model or CP disappears for good (and, IMHO, that is very unlikely).

Everyone seems to forget that trickles are completely irrelevant. You could download a model, get it running and only connect to the server again three (or whatever) weeks later when the model is complete - _never_ trickle at all. You would get exactly the same credit and CP would get exactly the same science as if you had trickled every day. I suspect there are people running CPDN on laptops who work that way.

I completely agree that the lack of feedback is regrettable, to say the least, but it is no reason for abandoning the project.

The only thing I would recommend, and I'm in this position at the moment, is that you don't let a model complete while the server is down - I've got one at 98% that I've just suspended and will only resume when the server is back.

Ian

> > You would think
> > > at least Boinc should Communicate with us??
> > > Please get with the Program!!!
> > > Sincerely:Doug Worrall
> > >
> > >
> ,but if it is better for Climate should I reduce 50%
> share with Einstein? Thank you John,Doug Worrall
> >
>
Before you do that, go to the Community msg boards at
http://www.climateprediction.net/board/index.php
and look for the latest report re the servers.
Otherwise, reduction seems to be a good idea for me, just in case there is some problem lurking in the work which we have completed, not uploaded.

Register on the other board. All the genii are there.

John Hop

Ian: re:
> > Week.Am not getting ERROR messages and am 70%
> > done and close to phase 3 cannot waste 346 Hours
> > of Computer time.I say "PLEASE" let us know
> > what is going on!!!!!

and:


> You would get exactly the same credit and CP would get exactly the same science as if you had trickled every day. I suspect there are people running CPDN on laptops who work that way.

> Ian
I agree with most of what you posted, however, I am not entirely convinced that loss of trickles is not a problem.

On my last model, just before uploading, Les Bayliss pointed out that I had missed a trickle in Phase 1 (!). Les helped me to manoever around a little and tried to rescue it, with some modest success. Thyme Lawn assured me that the science was intact, and the model would be productive. _BUT_ the Results for the model show the server state "in progress" and the outcome "unknown". Even today. (Could that change when the servers feel better? Maybe)

I don't argue with the big guns. Just keep the faith, and don't abandon the science.

John Hop

Well guys I turned down the seti processing rate and came to cpdn because it had a torrid long weekend not so long back. I decided that I would look at seti availability and based upon their performance make my shares reflect that. So they got no more than deserved....a nice performance measure...sort of pay and reward like.

Now I have "lost" trickles on cpdn since the 15th June. This makes my performance based share allocation a lot more difficult to calculate....let alone find another project. I just hope they get it sorted soon....but I will slow down an already low processing throughput just in case.

Good luck devs!
<img src="http://www.boincsynergy.com/images/stats/comb-1091.jpg"></img><br><img src="http://www.iantighe.com/setisig.jpg"></img><img border="0" src="http://boinc.mundayweb.com/one/teamStats.php?userID=1602&amp;prj=1&amp;trans=off">

&gt;
&gt; &gt; Week.Am not getting ERROR messages and am 70%
&gt; &gt; done and close to phase 3 cannot waste 346 Hours
&gt; &gt; of Computer time.I say "PLEASE" let us know
&gt; &gt; what is going on!!!!!
&gt;
&gt; Why do you think you are in danger of "wasting" 346 hours. The only way that
&gt; will happen is if you abandon the model or CP disappears for good (and, IMHO,
&gt; that is very unlikely).
&gt;
&gt; Everyone seems to forget that trickles are completely irrelevant. You could
&gt; download a model, get it running and only connect to the server again three
&gt; (or whatever) weeks later when the model is complete - _never_ trickle at all.
&gt; You would get exactly the same credit and CP would get exactly the same
&gt; science as if you had trickled every day. I suspect there are people running
&gt; CPDN on laptops who work that way.
&gt;
&gt; I completely agree that the lack of feedback is regrettable, to say the least,
&gt; but it is no reason for abandoning the project.
&gt;
&gt; The only thing I would recommend, and I'm in this position at the moment, is
&gt; that you don't let a model complete while the server is down - I've got one at
&gt; 98% that I've just suspended and will only resume when the server is back.
&gt;
&gt; Ian
&gt;Thanks Ian to reiterate "I would never drop an experiment trickles or not.
Thanks Doug&gt;

Announcement about the server on the cpdn home page now, so the problem should gradually get sorted.
__________________________________________________

Hi there

John E Hopkinson said:

&gt; On my last model, just before uploading, Les Bayliss pointed out that I had
&gt; missed a trickle in Phase 1 (!). Les helped me to manoever around a little and
&gt; tried to rescue it, with some modest success. Thyme Lawn assured me that the
&gt; science was intact, and the model would be productive. _BUT_ the Results for
&gt; the model show the server state "in progress" and the outcome "unknown". Even
&gt; today. (Could that change when the servers feel better? Maybe)

Regardless of missing 'mid experiment' trickles, the entire scientific data will be received when the model completes and uploads. However, in my experience, unless a complete set of 72 trickles has been received for the run at the time of final upload, the server state will show as "Over" but the Outcome will remain as "unknown" and the Client State as "New". So if you want to have models showing as "Over", "Success" and "Done", ensure you restore missing trickles by any of the methods given by various contributors on the main php boards before the model completes. The problems are now reported as fixed but it will take a while to clear upload backlogs etc so it may be wise to suspend models very close to end of phase or final upload for a day or so until everything is running correct again. That is what I have done.

HTH

Pete

&gt;
&gt; However, in my experience, unless a complete set of 72 trickles has been
&gt; received for the run at the time of final upload, the server state will show
&gt; as "Over" but the Outcome will remain as "unknown" and the Client State as
&gt; "New". So if you want to have models showing as "Over", "Success" and "Done",
&gt; ensure you restore missing trickles by any of the methods given by various
&gt; contributors on the main php boards before the model completes.
&gt;

Well, that wasn't my experience... I had a trickle missing in my last model (<a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=546416">result here</a>, number of trickles is 71), but as you can see <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/workunit.php?wuid=366381">here</a> it got uploaded and reported just fine.

Maybe something else has happened with your model(s)...

I've had 3 models upload during this trickle drought, and all of them were labelled as "Success" on the results page, despite having less than 2/3 of the normal 72 trickles.

&gt; I've had 3 models upload during this trickle drought, and all of them were
&gt; labelled as "Success" on the results page, despite having less than 2/3 of the
&gt; normal 72 trickles.
&gt;
I also got success, but not the right credit total.
Disabling BOINC access seems to be the best solution till we get news.
Latest is I see trickles from 16 June, though total hasn't changed, so hopefully all is not lost ;-)

<a href="http://www.boincsynergy.com"><img src="http://www.boincsynergy.com/images/stats/308cpdn.png"></a> <a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/forum_text_search_form.php"> <b>SEARCH THE FORUM</b></a>

Ertugrul Gocken said:

&gt; Well, that wasn't my experience... I had a trickle missing in my last model
&gt; (<a> href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=546416"&gt;result
&gt; here</a>, number of trickles is 71), but as you can see <a> href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/workunit.php?wuid=366381"&gt;here</a>
&gt; it got uploaded and reported just fine.
&gt;
&gt; Maybe something else has happened with your model(s)...
&gt;
Yes, looks like it was an isolated problem for me then, perhaps at the time the final upload occurred for the affected model.

It seems the trickles are beginning to show again now though. I'll upload my backlog a few (2-3) at a time until they are all up to date, while at the same time suspending one of my runs now which is about 1 hr away from a phase change until it becomes clear that all is OK again.

Pete

&gt; On my last model, just before uploading, Les Bayliss pointed out that I had
&gt; missed a trickle in Phase 1 (!). Les helped me to manoever around a little and
&gt; tried to rescue it, with some modest success. Thyme Lawn assured me that the
&gt; science was intact, and the model would be productive. _BUT_ the Results for
&gt; the model show the server state "in progress" and the outcome "unknown". Even
&gt; today. (Could that change when the servers feel better? Maybe)

FWIW. I just looked through my results and found result ID 808760. The server has has only received 65 trickles but has a status of Over/Success - it appears to have missed 7 trickles during phase 1 without any ill effect. I also got exactly the same credit (6805.26) as models that were completed with 72 trickles.



Ian

Looking at my results, there are 72 trickles listed, but no graphs available no full credit. Those model were uploaded during latest server problems.

http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=807562
http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=810853
http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=845530
_________________________
<i>Everyday i wished classic phpBB forum being back and after 60 prayers, all are </i><a href="http://www.climateprediction.net/board">invited</a>

&gt; Looking at my results, there are 72 trickles listed, but no graphs available
&gt; no full credit. Those model were uploaded during latest server problems.
&gt;
&gt; http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=807562
&gt; http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=810853
&gt; http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/result.php?resultid=845530

Although all the trickles have been inserted into the database table it looks like there's still a backlog in processing them as none of the models have received the full credits for a completed run yet. My guess is that the graphs will appear when the results get their full 6805.26 credits.
<br><a href="http://www.teampicard.net/"><img src="http://www.teampicard.net/images/picardmini.gif"></a><a href="http://climateapps2.oucs.ox.ac.uk/cpdnboinc/team_display.php?teamid=3">Join us here</a>

&gt;
&gt; &gt; On my last model, just before uploading, Les Bayliss pointed out that I
&gt; had
&gt; &gt; missed a trickle in Phase 1 (!). Les helped me to manoever around a
&gt; little and
&gt; &gt; tried to rescue it, with some modest success. Thyme Lawn assured me that
&gt; the
&gt; &gt; science was intact, and the model would be productive. _BUT_ the
&gt; Results for
&gt; &gt; the model show the server state "in progress" and the outcome "unknown".
&gt; Even
&gt; &gt; today. (Could that change when the servers feel better? Maybe)
&gt;
&gt; FWIW. I just looked through my results and found result ID 808760. The
&gt; server has has only received 65 trickles but has a status of Over/Success - it
&gt; appears to have missed 7 trickles during phase 1 without any ill effect. I
&gt; also got exactly the same credit (6805.26) as models that were completed with
&gt; 72 trickles.
&gt;
&gt;
&gt;
&gt; Ian
&gt;
Thanks Ian.
I am continuing to monitor the latest model.
John Hopkinson
&gt;